Roof wont raise

[staples]

Roof wont raise, caused no doubt by the fact that it hasn't been used for 8 months. (Other owners note that its probably a good idea to raise the roof every month or so just to maintain the mechanism.
So here is what I have done so far. Handbrake light lit so that switch is working OK.
Beeping working so electronics are OK. (Both the electronics fuses and the power fuses to the roof module are OK.)
Checked control module located at back right hand corner of bongo behind the trim above the wheel arch.
Checked power supply to the module. Ground OK and supply from the main fuse present when ignition on.
Finally applied power directly and very briefly to the red and blue cables on the module output which go to the roof motors. I can hear a brief clunk in each direction, so the motors are attempting to rotate and taking up the slack in the drive, but not able to move the roof. As I have no idea which polarity is raising and which lowering the roof, I was very careful not to apply current long enough to blow a fuse or overload a motor.
which leads to my question. Does this mean I now have to remove the entire headlining, and unfasten all the screws holding the roof rails, in order to lift the back end of the roof and disconnect the motor drives, so that I can a). test the motors, and b). attempt to lift the roof manually.
The roof is obviously locked down near the front by the rollers fully forward into the locking cups, and I can feel these by unzipping the fabric side panels and mosquito netting, but of course cant see them. I can feel one securing nut on each, which I could undo, but don't know if there is more than one nut on each, in which case removing the nut would not help.
Its pretty clear that the most likely cause of the problem is seized linkage on one or both sides, so my question is if there is another, easier not immediately obvious way of getting at the roof linkage, without dismantling all the headlining, and what amounts to pretty well removing the whole roof.

[g8dhe]

One or two people in the past have managed to get it working sufficiently to get at the motors and clean them up, by operating the up/down button lots of times, each time the motor rotates a little to and fro and eventually freed up sufficiently to let the roof rise. Worth trying as its a cheap and simple and very little effort!!

[mikeonb4c]

You do not have to remove the headlining. You do have to remove the little bolt covers in tbe headlining to (i think) loosen the rear roof retaining bolts. But the roof is also very heavy. My mechanic Adrian at Japandirect in Bury is very used to dealing with Bongo roofs (done mine 3 times!) and if you're not near him i daresay he'd offer advice to you or whoever local is trying to fix it. Unless you have overhead lifting equipment though you'll need a few strong pairs of hands i think.

Try Geoffs tip first though as you might get lucky

Good luck, keep us posted.

[cmm303]

Fact sheet in members area http://igmaynard.co.uk/download/aft.pdf

[staples]

One or two people in the past have managed to get it working sufficiently to get at the motors and clean them up, by operating the up/down button lots of times, each time the motor rotates a little to and fro and eventually freed up sufficiently to let the roof rise. Worth trying as its a cheap and simple and very little effort!!

Managed to get at the motors from the back end by unbolting the four bolts at the rear that hold the roof on. However you need to be very careful not to lever the rear up too far when the front is still locked in position. You can just manage to get a hand in to undo the 4 MM Allen screws and drop the motor out.
In my case one motor was completely siezed and had to be dismantled. The elongated part of the motor contains the armature and brushes with the worm drive to the wheelon the end of the armature. The round wheel driven by the worm also incorporates a slip clutch, so one should be very careful about bathing the whole unit in WD40 to unsieze it as this will probably wreck the slip clutch material.
Also you need to be very careful about working the motors backwards and forwards to try and free them and raise the roof, as what you are likely to do is wear out the slip clutches, which are not very robust, and clearly designed to take up the initial surge of movement, and are there to protect the motor from burnout if the roof hits an obstacle on the way up or down. The clutch is adjusted with the nut which is locked by a tab washer. Without torque setting information you can only set this with intuition or guesswork. When you dismantle one of the aft motors, beware of the brush springs flying out and being lost.
During reassembly, I found the brushes and springs could be held in place with a loop of terylene thread with a slip knot that could be snipped, and the thread drawn out once the armature was in place. Hope this helps someone.

[staples]

Just an additional question now about tha AFT. Does anyone know where the roof UP microswitch is situated. I have found the roof down switch but need to find the roof up switch as the beeper is not switching off, so the signal from the up switch is not getting through. Thanks.

[S0L]

Not an expert on this, but I think these are the two microswitches in the runners. With the roof up, look at the top from underneath and you can see them there towards the front of the Bongo. They're mentioned in the fact sheet linked too BTW.

I think the one on the drivers side is the roof down switch, so I'm going to say it's the one on the passenger side. Note one of the two recently caused my roof to stop raising full stop, I've worked around it by now by disconnecting them both, but then I have a control box where the beeper doesn't work...

Steve

[g8dhe]

There are 4 limit switches that control position of the AFT.
Two at the front (top) which both have to operate to signal the computer that it is safely down and the front runners are under the "hoods"
One in the middle, that controls the stop on the way down when you check the inside.
one at the rear which signals that the AFT has reached maximum height.
Wiring diagrams and click the Orange box for the computer mosule;

[staples]

There are 4 limit switches that control position of the AFT.
Two at the front (top) which both have to operate to signal the computer that it is safely down and the front runners are under the "hoods"
One in the middle, that controls the stop on the way down when you check the inside.
one at the rear which signals that the AFT has reached maximum height.
Wiring diagrams and click the Orange box for the computer mosule;

This answer was a great help. Thank you. have found the down switches and the mid switch mentioned, which are all working. However I am unable to find the up switch, the one that doesn't seem to work. there does not seem to be a switch at the rear on either side, but nor can I find a spare plug /socket. or any loose wiring that suggests a switch has been removed. It is a bit of a mystery. I am not a stranger to micro switches and sensors as I build and commission machine tool controls, but in the area reached by the rollers that I would expect to be activating a switch for the up position, I can find nothing, despite the easy access when the roof is up. Anyone else had this problem?

[g8dhe]

I must admit I haven't looked for the "UP" switch, I've always assumed it was hidden behind the actual arm/slider when it was at the highest position. If I get a chance I'll try and locate it on mine, but its in to the garage tomorrow for radiator repairs, so not sure if i'll get a chance as its raining at the moment as well! Suspect might need to lower the roof a good way before it might be visible and then the gap outside is narrow to get a camera in!

[g8dhe]

Yea found it! Very difficult to reach, as we have an awning fitted on the nearside which makes access fiddly!
Front Nearside top (Down limit switch one of two);


Nearside middle (pause);


Nearside rear (UP) limit switch;

[staples]

Yep. Got it! That was a great help thanks. I can see that it is not quite being reached, mainly because the tapes on the 'tent' are stretched to the limit. I will find a way round it now. Thanks again.

[mikeonb4c]

Yep. Got it! That was a great help thanks. I can see that it is not quite being reached, mainly because the tapes on the 'tent' are stretched to the limit. I will find a way round it now. Thanks again.

In case it's relevant, it is very common for the raising roof to need a little human assistance for it to complete the last bit of raising and reach the limit switch that stops the beeping. If that's your only problem then i'd proceed cautiously with attempts at remedying it.

[g8dhe]

Its possible that someone might have replaced the tent with an old version type which is a few inches shorter at the front ? However they are also known for the material "shrinking" if so undoing the main zip can help a lot as it lets it up that little bit more.

[MhairiG]

I'm so grateful for this thread....it turns out our bongo also needs to have the blowers on to raise the roof! Thanks folks!