Had any rear arch work done yet?

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Had any rear wheelarch work done yet?

Poll ended at Wed Aug 10, 2011 6:56 pm

Yes, they have been repaired in the past.
12
21%
No, they have never been repaired to the best of my knowledge.
20
34%
No, but they may require attention soon by the looks of them.
26
45%
 
Total votes: 58
tallbongo
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by tallbongo » Fri Jul 15, 2011 12:32 am

Mine are in a similar condition to stuc's. They'll be getting replaced as soon as I find a decent bodywork repairer at a decent price.

Unfortunately (if stuc's right about the Sprinter arches) I've already purchased the Transit mk6 arches for the job.

If anyone can enlighten me about exactly what difference there is in the job between the two different arches, I'd be very interested to hear it. Chances are, nobody had done repairs using both :(
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Trouble at t'Mill
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by Trouble at t'Mill » Sat Jul 16, 2011 3:24 pm

I hope everyone reading or replying to this thread is aware of where this rust is coming through from?

For instance, the typical rust in the photo above from Jaylee: http://i1088.photobucket.com/albums/i33 ... 1_2139.jpg cannot be felt by reaching under the wheel arch with your fingers, as it's located - hidden - in between two metal body panels. One panel is the painted outer body wing you are actually looking at, and the other is the panel under the arch which surrounds the wheel - ie: the muddy panel you see beyond and above the wheel! To gain access to where this rust is actually taking place, you need to remove the plastic storage pockets fitted inside your vehicle over each wheel arch, and have a look down there where you'll see where the two panels join. And where the rust forms.

The two panels involved are joined along their seam by, I presume, spot-welding. The problem here is that the spot welds are - what? - a couple of inches apart from each other? This means that the 'seam' is not completely sealed but will have very small gaps between them (think of two sheets of paper laid on top of each other and stapled along one edge every couple of inches. In between these staples the paper will not be joined or sealed). And, because the two sheets are fitted very tightly together, this will actually draw water in between them by capillary action.

If you reach just under the wheel arch with your fingers and feel the sharpish edge behind, you are fingering where two sheets of metal touch and join. This edge will be sprayed with water whenever you drive in the wet and water will be drawn in by capillary-action between the two layers where it will settle as there is next to no air flow to dry them. The water will sit there hidden for hours afterwards doing what it does best - causing rust. It might also be the case that moisture originating from within the Bongo (eg, from your sleeping, breathing bodies!) finds its way in between these panels where it condenses against the colder outside panels, but that's just a guess at a possibility on my part.

So, if you simply sand away rust bubbles as they appear and respray it, it simply ain't gonna work. You are painting over tiny rust holes in the bodywork - where water and rust will come back through in no time. If you simply Waxoyl under your wheel arches, it simply ain't gonna work as you are not coating and protecting where the rust will begin. (Having said that, I reckon there might be some mileage in coating the 'edge' of the join with Waxoyl or similar in the hope it'll seal off this edge to the elements. Mind you, that's a very thin edge you are trying to coat...)

What's the solution? I think you need to seal that seam from the inside. How do you fill such a tight seam? It needs to be bone dry, ideally warm, and the 'sealant' used needs to be very 'watery' so that it, too, will be drawn in by capillary action. Since I like Waxoyl, this is what I use for these kinds of jobs. However, where it comes to such tight seams, I thin the mix WAY beyond what the manufacturers recommend. I really make it very slooshy indeed (and I use petrol as it's cheap and 'flashes off' quickly - but bear in mind how flammable that is, so I don't recommend it... :oops: ) and fire down through the removed oddments tray apertures above the wheel arches. And I mean really blast that area and saturate it thoroughly. And then again. And again. It's also worth removing the rear light clusters and gently prise out the rubber grommet on the wiring loom. The gap there will now allow a probe to point through. Blast away, dudes!

With luck, a bead of Waxoyl will appear along the panel seams on the outside, in which case you know you've done the job. However, it might not show, so don't worry! There's no harm in blasting a neat coat of Waxoyl down there a couple of days later either, just to give the seam in there a darn good coating.

Ok, this will make your car STINK. For at least a couple of weeks. I don't care if you 'like' the smell of Waxoyl, it will drive you barmy to have to live in it, so please don't do this job before a trip!

Bottom line, if an undersealing/Waxoyling/Dinitrolling/ DOESN'T include coating INSIDE these panels, then the weakest rust point on the Bongo will simply not have been protected in my opinion.
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stuc
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by stuc » Sat Jul 16, 2011 9:31 pm

Trouble at t mill is correct in where the rust will form. this is the problem mazda has had on most of their recent models. During production they did not seal the edge where the inner and outer arch meet and as said the moisture lies there and corrodes from the inside out. Best thing to do is use brushable seam sealer inside the van and inside the wheelarch edge to try and seal that join. Then when this is dry waxoyl the life out of it.
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tallbongo
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by tallbongo » Mon Jul 18, 2011 6:20 pm

Thanks. I've known the need to waxoyl the inner wheel arches, but the earlier description is the first that's actually clarified where to get into them from. Hopefully I've got it right and this pic will help any others wondering.

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technophobe
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by technophobe » Mon Jul 18, 2011 6:44 pm

had no need as yet. This week, preparing to go on our annual European tril found two pin prick sized spots, on the silver. Used kurrust and some touch up paint.
I think the undersealing and waxoiling done when the vehicle hit Dover docks and biannual waxoiling is keeping the terror at bay
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by Kitegirl » Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:02 pm

1995 4x4 manual imported 5 years ago through algy's autos... already had the rears done once, they're both going pretty bad and am going to need to get them done again soonish :(
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by New Forest Terrier » Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:25 pm

Thanks Trouble at t'Mill. Reassures me that my rustproof job was a thorough one. I picked up up mine after rustproofing on the Wednesday and went to a festival on the Friday. It stank of Waxoyl even with all windows open and I ended sleeping in the tent. There was also waxoyl that oozed from the seams as you mentioned, which had to completely harden before it could be cleaned off.

It took about a month for the smell to completely go away. It competed nicely with the left over Japanese nicotine and a vicious vanilla air freshener.

I did wonder at the time if I had over fussed on this one, but there are so many Japanese imports round here destroyed by rust in quite a short time; I didn't want mine to go the same way.
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by dunslair » Fri Jul 22, 2011 8:33 am

Ours was showing signs of rust on the rims of the rear arches (not on the face) as if by stone chips. When I had a scrape and dent in the rear bumper fixed (thanks to whoveer did that and ran away :roll: ) I had the rims coated to stop it progressing. 2003 bongo, yes in white........ One thing about the white vans is you do notice any rust spots very early on :wink: Also showing signs or rust at the bottom of the tailgate and behind the rear bumper at the spare wheel release hole.
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by Sharkojoints » Fri Jul 22, 2011 9:56 am

1996 green AFT. No rust on either arch, but I looked at quite a few Bongos before I bought this one which were pretty ripe. Green ones seemed to be a bit less rusty, although maybe that's just my impression.

I bought our Bongo largely on the basis of no rust, as I can't stand rusty cars. Already blasted a mixture of Waxoyl and engine oil into the inner arches until the van stank, and plastered it liberally all over the underside. 1 year later and it's all still looking good! :)
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by yorkshirelass » Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:40 pm

Hi Ste,...Mines a 1996 AFT in green/silver. Both rear arches need doing now as bubbling has broken open now and some rust showing....no holes tho'. Never had it waxoiled...my garage said it was not necessary.Plan to have my arches done before winter, but am still trying to get a quote lower than £500 for both arches. A different thread re this subject said the rubbing down etc etc was not as good as replacement rims [?] 'made' for the job were far better. BUT.... Peg leg Pete had his done this way by Stuart ?...the chap you all go on about/is reliable etc etc; and within a few short months the rust was back !!!! So, what do you think IS the best way of tackling this problem ? Its seems that 'luck' is playing its part with some vans, rather than a tried/tested method.
By the way...'Stuart' [?] said when I rang him re this problem earlier this year, that using replacement arches/rims from other vehicles/makes is NOT the way to go.....only HIS way is best !! It was only later that I spoke to Peg leg Pete...... ! SoWhat do you all think ? I'm still in the dark !!!!!!!!!!!! #-o
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stuc
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Re: Had any rear arch work done yet?

Post by stuc » Sun Jul 24, 2011 8:11 pm

It all depends on how good the people are who are doing the work. I have seen new arches replaced and people making a right arse of it, but i have also seen them rubbed down and treated then painted and, as said rust came back very quickly. Even when the work looks good it has to stand the test of time which is the difference. If a job is cheap it is probably for a reason.
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