Sluggish Acceleration

Northern Bongolow · Post by **Northern Bongolow** » Mon Mar 14, 2016 12:39 am

http://www.bankspower.com/techarticles/ ... gate-Works.

this explains how it all works. if your down on power via a blocked air filter or poor fuel flow/quality it wont develop enough boost pressure so it wont need to open the waste gate as pressure is low.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCGDxzKKBjs

cmm303 · Post by **cmm303** » Mon Mar 14, 2016 10:33 am

Northern Bongolow wrote:yes. its not easy to get off but if you look at the thread i linked to above it shows how to remove it or split it in half then clean out.

if its the wastegate stuck not the diaphragm i would try a spray release and lever first, dont use wd40 as its not a release agent get something right for the job, then spray it over a few days and let it do its thing then dont hit it with a hammer, just lever it steadily until it moves, soak it again and move a little more until it gets full movement.

Is this the sort of stuff you had in mind (Plusgas)?
Can I spray it inside the turbo on the wastegate spindle?

Fassi · Post by **Fassi** » Mon Mar 14, 2016 10:38 am

Does anyone know if the green and white check valve arrow should point Up (green up) or Down (green down)? I'm assuming it should point Down so as the vacuum is held until the air intake pulls the valve open? But photos I have seen have the arrow upwards or green at the top. regards.

Fassi · Post by **Fassi** » Mon Mar 14, 2016 10:42 am

Northern Bongolow wrote:http://www.bankspower.com/techarticles/ ... gate-Works.

this explains how it all works. if your down on power via a blocked air filter or poor fuel flow/quality it wont develop enough boost pressure so it wont need to open the waste gate as pressure is low.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCGDxzKKBjs

watched this guy yesterday and it all made sense. my wastegate rod is solid and wont move so will work out why today. Drove with the seat up and seemed that when pressure built, instead of the wastegate opening, plumes of smoke were released from somewhere else on the exhaust side into the cabin.

Northern Bongolow · Post by **Northern Bongolow** » Mon Mar 14, 2016 12:14 pm

cmm303 wrote:
Northern Bongolow wrote:yes. its not easy to get off but if you look at the thread i linked to above it shows how to remove it or split it in half then clean out.

if its the wastegate stuck not the diaphragm i would try a spray release and lever first, dont use wd40 as its not a release agent get something right for the job, then spray it over a few days and let it do its thing then dont hit it with a hammer, just lever it steadily until it moves, soak it again and move a little more until it gets full movement.
Is this the sort of stuff you had in mind (Plusgas)?
Can I spray it inside the turbo on the wastegate spindle?

yes anything like that should be fine, please be aware that most of these are flammable though, inside will be ok, once it starts to move just keep re applying until your happy its free. have you tested the actuator.

cmm303 · Post by **cmm303** » Mon Mar 14, 2016 9:12 pm

Northern Bongolow wrote: yes anything like that should be fine, please be aware that most of these are flammable though, inside will be ok, once it starts to move just keep re applying until your happy its free. have you tested the actuator.

Nope! Time off from Bongo labours, have to go out to pay its keep

But ... driving to work I was thinking about how I could do it. A little pump has so little volume of air that the pressure will rocket with the smallest movement so I wondered about a mountain bike track pump which has a much large volume. The weight of the handle alone might be enough, if not a gentle finger on it would do. And its got a gauge.

I thought I would first have another go at popping out the rod from the wastegate arm and halve the problem. With the arm parallel to the hot gas outlet (i.e. perpendicular to the actuating rod) I presume it is closed. Would not being able to "spill" turbo power have had a knock on effect somewhere?

Fassi · Post by **Fassi** » Tue Mar 15, 2016 5:28 pm

cmm303 wrote:
Northern Bongolow wrote: yes anything like that should be fine, please be aware that most of these are flammable though, inside will be ok, once it starts to move just keep re applying until your happy its free. have you tested the actuator.

Nope! Time off from Bongo labours, have to go out to pay its keep

But ... driving to work I was thinking about how I could do it. A little pump has so little volume of air that the pressure will rocket with the smallest movement so I wondered about a mountain bike track pump which has a much large volume. The weight of the handle alone might be enough, if not a gentle finger on it would do. And its got a gauge.

I thought I would first have another go at popping out the rod from the wastegate arm and halve the problem. With the arm parallel to the hot gas outlet (i.e. perpendicular to the actuating rod) I presume it is closed. Would not being able to "spill" turbo power have had a knock on effect somewhere?[/quote]

What I'm wondering too. If the wastegate is stuck will it 'blow' somewhere else.

cmm303 · Post by **cmm303** » Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:24 pm

Northern Bongolow wrote: yes anything like that should be fine, please be aware that most of these are flammable though, inside will be ok, once it starts to move just keep re applying until your happy its free. have you tested the actuator.

Success. The spring is a lot stronger than I expected and I can move the wastegate lever with pliers. Let go and it snaps shut with a thud. Next I tested the actuator with a track pump. Firstly these gauges are notoriously inaccurate so I was happy it was all in the right ball park. The wastegate did most of its opening around 20 psi, with a little more movement up to 30 psi. This is at its most open, is this what you would expect?

and a vid .... Video: Testing Wastegate

Northern Bongolow · Post by **Northern Bongolow** » Wed Mar 16, 2016 3:41 am

yes that sounds right. the last post on this link shows the operating pressures needed.

http://www.igmaynard.co.uk/bongo/forum/ ... =3&t=71575.

just had a good look through your pics in your album, look like your having fun.

the water pump you have removed is a gen mazda one if your interested, its got a different impeller, with less but bigger blades. mine ran 1 deg hotter when i fitted a non gen mazda one like you are, not a lot in the grand scheme of things.

you did well to get the large nut out of the exhaust manifold to egr link pipe, are you replacing it or have you found something that fits to blank it off, its a very strange thread.

cmm303 · Post by **cmm303** » Wed Mar 16, 2016 11:26 am

Northern Bongolow wrote:yes that sounds right. the last post on this link shows the operating pressures needed.

http://www.igmaynard.co.uk/bongo/forum/ ... =3&t=71575.

just had a good look through your pics in your album, look like your having fun. the water pump you have removed is a gen mazda one if your interested, its got a different impeller, with less but bigger blades. mine ran 1 deg hotter when i fitted a non gen mazda one like you are, not a lot in the grand scheme of things.

you did well to get the large nut out of the exhaust manifold to egr link pipe, are you replacing it or have you found something that fits to blank it off, its a very strange thread.

I carefully check against all your comments, Northern B.

Partly why I wanted to air the fact that it did not seem to stop all its movement around the 20psi reading (which could well be 17.5psi in reality). Since it is the only wastegate I have seen it is helpful to have somebody else's feedback. Thanks.

Yes, replacing a few hoses has turned into mammoth job. Taken photos partly as record and so I know how to put it all back.

Manifold skimmed yesterday at a mate of my local garage. £25. Chuffed

I took the pics of the pump because I noticed they were different and it came with 4 spare studs which I didn't know where to stick! I think the Ranger uses studs to attach the pulley.
I was just going to put the EGR back on unless there is an easy solution. Its blanked off on the other side. Time is now running away because ....

Not so chuffed with myself - kept quiet about this - messed up big time with no. 1 stud. Could not buy a 6.8mm drill locally for the M8 tap when I was doing the stud work. Had some extractors in my bag from 40 years ago. Worked a treat on the broken but proud no. 8 stud. Well, the extractors are now in the bin except one which is in my cylinder head. Kicked myself, was about to do a tactical withdrawal when it pinged. I know I know against all advice. Grrr.

Don't want to stray into taking the head off so I have become obsessively acquainted over many hours with a hole in my head.

Never Never do it again. The manifold would be back on, if only.

My biggest worry when I started the job was bleeding it for the first time. Now, apart from feeling like a pipe dream, it seems almost trivial. I know it isn't

On a positive, I have learnt a lot about the passy side of the engine, that not all hoses off the radiator carry water, and that I have some rusty looking pipes.

Northern Bongolow · Post by **Northern Bongolow** » Wed Mar 16, 2016 1:43 pm

i feel your pain mate on the stud extractor breaking in the number 1 stud, can you take a photo and put it on here, not to laugh at but to see how others may remove it. there are companies out there that specialise in just this type of extraction, or someone out here may have a trick. ive found that these type of things tend to swell the stud so locking it in the head, it depends how deep the extractor is in the stud, sometimes a pin punch tapped clockwise can loosen its grip if there is a suitable step in the extractor, then fish it out. they are quite steep in angle so dont get a long deep grip just a shallow grip if you see what i mean. the companies that remove snapped studs usually employ a freeze technique on the stud/extractor and warm up the surrounding head/metal, or an arc proccess. the first is the method used when fitting the 3 exit piece in the head for the bleed pipe etc. this is an example of one of these companies, never used em though it shows the technology is out there.

http://www.brokenstudandboltremoval.co.uk/.

the spare studs are for the ranger.

this is the best bit, learning about your motor, sometimes its hard won knowledge, but when its done its a great feeling, and it gives you confidence to tackle the next big job,

cmm303 · Post by **cmm303** » Wed Mar 16, 2016 4:14 pm

To avoid hijacking this thread, I've carried on with the detail on no. 1 stud removal on my original thread here.

Fassi · Post by **Fassi** » Fri Mar 25, 2016 5:22 pm

Northern Bongolow wrote:on this thread you will see the wastegate, its at the other end of the rod that should move under vac pressure, or move when pulled with pliers.

http://www.igmaynard.co.uk/bongo/forum/ ... ud#p418217.

on the pic of the drivers side there is a thin pipe that goes from the right hand side of the pic (the inlet manifold) to the top of the fuel pump, its about 10mm dia. this pipe should have suction on it from the inlet manifold when the engine is revved up, this operates a diaphragm in the top of the pump, check the pipe is not holed or rubbed through, make sure its not blocked with oil, some are, then remove the screws that hold the top of the pump in place where the pipe goes into the top of the pump, there is a big weakish spring then the diaphragm, this can get filled with oil this stops the diaphragm operating so reduces fuel into the pump inerds.

mine today, oil came out as soon as the bolts were loose.

Northern Bongolow · Post by **Northern Bongolow** » Fri Mar 25, 2016 9:20 pm

has it made a difference to the power/acceleration,

Fassi · Post by **Fassi** » Fri Mar 25, 2016 9:47 pm

was just out in it and it is performing so much better. No more random levels of power and mostly lack of power when accelerating. Turbo definitely working. The air hose supplying the fuel pump basically crumbled into bits when I removed it too. So new hose was put on first and it gave some improvement. Then the oil cleaned out and it is a joy now. Nice one mate

cheers

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